Real or Fake????

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

If I was a betting person, I would say they are a fake. First is that the rust looks like it was induced rapidly to age it. Second, for a slave shackle or even punitive, why would someone take the time to do the ornate makings on it. Second is the missing parts of the lock. The lock looks like the asian type of using the slide key. Just too suspicious and the starting price of $499 USD. Smells like a rat to me...

-Dorson

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

Can some one tell me how people this cuff put it on? Are these legcuffs for slave?

and have someone picture of people in this cuffs?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

Early restraints often used a "Puzzle Lock" on one cuff. This meant that the smith only needed to make one expensive lock.

The lock, which is sometimes removeable like a big padlock, is unlocked. The lock and chain are threaded through the loose link in the top center of the photo. This presumably results in a lock-up that is too small to draw the other foot from. The lock is then locked around the opposite ankle. This is a trickier game for handcuffs, as the fit must be tighter to capture a hand.

- Dennis

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

Here's an even better example of "authentic slave shackles"

http://cgi.ebay.com/Rosa-Parks-Autograp ... dZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

Those are of a pattern similar to items that were actually used, both in the US and in Africa. They were essentially ankle weights, often quite decorative. A friend has a nice one bought in Africa, that must weigh ten pounds.

The ones pictured look too small, but I'm too lazy to find a reproduction Declaration of Independance to use as a scale. The fact that they're bundled in with a bunch of sentimental associative junk makes me triply suspicious, as does the low price.

It should be noted, however, that setting extremely low opening prices on eBay is often done as a marketing tactic to whip up interest. I suppose it's safer if you have a shill to illegally run up the prices for you. That's a Federal crime, but probably hard to catch if done cleverly.

Caveat Emptor.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

Did you notice that they put them up for sale just in time for the opening of "Black History Month".....very nice. "Here, it wasn't bad enough that the African American people went through slavery, the Civil Rights movement, and God only knows what else.......but now let's crow-bar some money out of them by selling bogus relics to them during the one month that they can call their own!" That is just plain WRONG!!!

Cheers, Mike

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

Hi all,

I have watched this thread for sometime now and decided to finally throw in my 2 cents on this matter.

The shackles under discussion are NOT fake in any way.

However, they are not for humans either.

I had an identical set of these once and they were too large even for large human feet to be restrained.

After a good deal of research and back checking, I found out that my particular pair has origins in the Middle East and were likely as not cammel hobbles to lock the camels up at night to prevent russlers from stealing them.

They were indeed very old and the engraving on the shackles and chain sections likely denoted a particular owner of a particular animal.

There are a number of such puzzle shackles that were made for humans and these were commonly used in Europe, Asia, and the Middle East as early as the late 1600's early 1700's.

In fact, such types of shackles for humans date back even farther, going back to the days of the Romans.

As has been said before, the puropse of the puzzle side was to cut down on the hand forging work the blacksmith had to do when making them.

Commonly, such items are fitted with screw key or spring wedge compression locks as these were among the first functional lock mechanisms fitted to restraints of any type.

Neck collars and hand irons are also seen with the puzzle shackle function.

I have one very unusual leg shackle in my collection that is European and has one side as a puzzle shackle.

What is neat about this one is that the lock is a COMBINATION of both the screw key and spring wedge lock principals.

The key must first be threaded past entrance threads which also act as wards before it can proceed far enough into the lock tube to compress the 4 springs of the locking wedge plug.

This set of irons is illustrated in the Handcuff Annual 2006.

I brought all of this up to make the point that just because something may look or smeel "fishy" to the unitiated, this does not mean such an item is not what it is claimed to be.

It only really means that one must learn more about such items in order to correctly indentify them.

Steve Santini

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

Steve, you are talking about the set that I posted the picture of right? But what do you think about the ones in the post from Russell? The ones that are on eBay right now with the Rosa Parks autograph? These are really not shackles, but rather a set of weights, like an Oregon Boot.....the "Kenya Boot"! LOL!!! Are these fakes or genuine, in your opinion?

Cheers, Mike

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

Hi Mike,

Yes, I was speaking about the set of irons pictured.

Regarding the single non locking "slave bracelet", what a lot of people don't seem to remember is that North America was only one of the very many cultures in history to practice slavery.

And, sad though it may seem, African peoples were enslaved by many, even by thier own.

The Dutch, the Spanish, the Egyptians, the Morrocans, among many others were ALL guilty of taking part in the trading of African slaves.

What is also seldom talked about is that conquering African tribes would sometimes take slaves themselves from other defeated tribes.

The single bracelet you have asked me about is to the best of my knowledge related to the Morrocan/African slave trade.

It has nothing at all to do with North American slavery at all.

I have seen slave bracelets like this before and done some research into them.

They are not meant as restraints but as identifying tags denoting ownership.

The lines and grooves etched into them serve to identify a particular "owner" or "house of ownership".

The enslaved person was required to wear it at all times.

Sure, it could be slipped off, but no doubt there would be harsh penalties for doing so.

We must also remember that slaves did not only work in fields or on the land.

They also went into town to perform errands, purchase goods for the household, etc.

This is where such a bracelet sees some purpose.

Anyone wearing it would easilly be identified as not being a free person and could be seen to be in the service of "so and so".

Hope this all makes sense and helps some.

Steve Santini

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

It seems the very term "slave shackles" ignites powerful emotions, and rightly so. Here's a site that may help clear up some misconceptions about what was used in the African slave trade, which were rigid restraints called bilboes:

http://www.melfisher.org/henriettamarie/ironbilboes.htm

From the historical accounts I've read about the American slave trade, when slave traders transported slaves on land, they were secured together in groups using neck collars, with hands tied behind with rope. Leg manacles, by impeding the ability to walk, would have been a hindrance to transport and caused injuries to the ankles.

As for chain type locking shackles for humans, jails (gaols) are expensive to build and prior to the 19th century were found only in larger cities. In less populated areas that could not justify the expense of a jail, prisoners awaiting trial were typically shackled at one ankle to a post, an iron ring set in a wall or floor, or some other stationary object. It was a cost effective way to keep the suspect secured until trial while permitting sufficient movement for him to "use the bucket" when nature called.

In early prisons, again for cost considerations, they typically were not divided up into small cells. Rather, within the large rooms, for crowd control purposes, the inmates similarly would be shackled to rings set into the floor or walls.

All in all, while we'll probably never know for sure, I think it most likely that chain type leg irons saw the vast majority of their use on criminals, rather than slaves.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

Regarding the Bilboe shackles:

For transporting slaves, Bilboe shackles were rather popular, at least on Spanish vessels, because they kept the ankles in a basically immobile position and severely limited movement.

The article linked to above also seems to miss another key reason why Bilboe shackles were used to some popularity by the slavers.

Namely, that compared to regular chain type shackles with manacles at either end, Bilboes were far easier to make and far cheaper.

In a sad industry like slavery where profit is concerned, keeping one's costs down would certainly ensure a greater profit margin.

Steve Santini

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

Hello All,This is an interesting topic as these "puzzle locking" items are on the auction block quite a bit on ebay. They are selling along a very broad price range (this is often due to the way the item is represented, I think). But from a bidder's point of view, even if he/she suspects that the thing is old, it's often tough to determine whether it is a horse/camel hobble or a human leg shackle. Here is a link to JM ROBIN'S assortment of such European and African examples.http://www.rigidcuff.com/2virgin.com/jm ... x.htmlBest, Paul

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Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

http://www.rigidcuff.com/2virgin.com/jmrobin/index.html

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

I found the mention of camel hobbles quite interesting. Since a camel has a paw instead of a hoof, I can see how they would work in that context.

As for the metal things sold on eBAy and at flea markets as "horse" hobbles, only an idiot would put such a thing on a horse. The bones and ligaments in the knees and fetlocks (ankles) of a horse are extremely delicate and easily injured. If a horse is hobbled (a controversial matter also), it's done with a leather or cloth restraint, tied or buckled above the front knees. Even then, this can cause the horse to go lame. Horses' legs are very sensitive. Trying to sneak a belt type leather hobble onto one is difficult, even with someone else holding the bridle. I can't imagine how you'd get a puzzle shackle in place without everyone getting the #### kicked out of them.

As an old farm boy, we did use a metal hobble, consisting of two shackles joined by a length of chain with a large ring in the middle of the chain. It was a cow fetter you put on the hind legs of a cow above the knees but only while milking it, sticking the cow's tail through the large ring, to keep the cow from kicking over the milk bucket or swatting you in the face with her tail. It did resemble a human leg shackle, and with a little simple blacksmithing on the shackles, perhaps could be converted to one.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

There is also a nice set of bilboes on the HMS Victory. They are secured to a wooden bollard, IIRC. I don't have a photo handy, but may in my library. Apparently, this was the conventional method of "clapping them in irons." As pointed out, bilboes are cheap to make. Any fool of a blacksmith can make them, while chains and locks take a lot of smithing.

In the end, the provenance of these supposedly old items can be hard to determine without having the actual items in hand and understanding blacksmithing techniues. Some of the obvious giveaways are modern, electrically welded chains, sharp, square cornered bars, fabrications made from thin sheet metal, arc welding, modern machine cut threads, castings, and machine tool marks. In the case of something actually hand smithed, the only indication might be the metal used. If it is mild steel, it's new. If it's wrought iron, it's probably old. You can tell by touching it to a grinding wheel and looking at the sparks. Even in the turd world, smiths all use steel now - often cut from automobile frames and springs. The next time I see those damthings described as "cast iron shackles," I may spit.

If I ever get my smithy going, hopefully before the summer, I hope to be able to produce some modern hand smithed (and properly labelled) reproductions of historical restraints, but presentable work is probably a couple of years down the pike. But the construction of these beasts interests me.

- Dennis

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Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

H.M.S. Victory bilboes:

http://www.hms-victory.com/index.php?op ... &Itemid=31

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Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

While the Victory and many other Royal Naval vessels of her time had bilboes, this particular set looks in far too good a condition to be authentic to her period.

Even with museum metal conservation techniques, these look too pristine to be proper.

Perhaps they were made at a later date for tourist visitors.

Steve Santini

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-SLAVE-SHACK ... dZViewItem

Okay guys and gals, here is a little test for you.....are these "slave shackles" real or fake????

Cheers, Mike

Yeah, particularly for ironwork exposed to the weather. I suspect there is a lot of new metal on the Victory. She was in pretty bad shape when they restored her. A lot of material would have needed replacing. This is to be expected on a vessel that is expectedto be "shipshape."

- Dennis