The Forum at Handcuffs.Org

boa prototypes for sale

30 visible archived posts · 30 preserved total · topic ID 2205

bill 22 Aug 2007

Does anyone know what current cost would be for theses cuffs. hc3p cuff. I am taking offers but do not know what is fair market for them.

Anonymous 22 Aug 2007

In 1999 they were selling for about $ 500.00 U.S.

bill 22 Aug 2007

wow $500 in 1999. I guess the last offer was not bad then. $1200 and the pair of cuffs I wanted. cool deal thanks

Unimuc 22 Aug 2007

Hi,

so you finally sold them? Congratulations! $1200? That's by far more than I'd expected!

But while you're here: could you answer one question regarding these cuffs?

How does the double lock work on them? I would expect the lock to have 3 positions:
1) "normal" - key can be removed, cuff is single-locking swing through. This is how you keep the cuff for quick arresting
2) "open" - turn the key (counter-clockwise) until the cuff opens, key can't be removed in this position
3) "locked" - and that's the point where the original BOA model would differ from newer boa/cuffmaxx cuffs. A second position where the key can be removed from the lock and leaves the cuff double-locked. This would be either half the way from normal to open, or in the opposite direction?

Is this correct? Could you (or anybody else having an original BOA cuff?) possibly verify this on your Boa prototype?

Martin

bill 22 Aug 2007

nope did not see them yet that was the offer. send me a private email and I will tell you.

bill 22 Aug 2007

did not sell them as of yet. That was just the offer. im not the highest bidder type. I want them with the right person.

Stan Willis 22 Aug 2007

This is how my prototype works:
There is a right hand and a left hand cuff, and one works clockwise and the other works counter-clockwise. From the picture, the cuff on the left works counterclockwise from the double lock position, which is with the red lines lined up. Key is removable in this position. Rotate counterclockwise about 10 degress and this is the single lock position. Key is removable in this position. Rotate another 10 degrees counter clockwise and this is the unlock to open position. Key is not removable. The cuff on the right works the same, except rotation is clockwise from the red lines lined up. I don't know if all the prototypes work the same way.
Stan

Unimuc 22 Aug 2007

Hi,

@Stan: Thanks for this excellent explanation and the picture! Pretty much what I expected from the original patent. Too bad they removed this second lock position from their cuffmaxx device (even though it would be technically possible, at least with peerless cuffs), thus making it vulnerable to bypass attacks. Hm, it MIGHT be possible to modify an cuffmaxx retrofit kit accordingly, depending on how much it can be disassembled before applying it to the cuff. Anybody here ever had one of the kits as a singluar item? Someone from BOA reading here?

@Bill: Don't take this personally, I'm sure you have a pretty nice cuff there, but if you're looking for serious offers, try to act more like a serious seller. I'm sure I'm not the only one who noticed your postings in at least 5 different threads (3 of them started by yourself, and this one with it's anonymous $500 reply, sorry...) advertising your prototype. Instead of mentioning it again and again, post a little more info (where from? directly BOA? how many keys?) and - most important - pictures of your actual cuff, and you should get serious offers.

Besides that: sell them for $1200. I would have no doubts that someone offering that much without even seeing a picture must be a really serious collector - can't be selling to wrong hands

Martin

Joseph Fox 22 Aug 2007

http://www.blacksteel.com/hcs/index.cgi ... &collector

These are mine above. Stan & I have different models.

Those that also have a model - how about posting a photo here for comparisons?

...future article for a "Handcuff Annual"?

Stan Willis 22 Aug 2007

#10

Hi Joe:
Other than yours has both cuffs the same handed, is there another difference ?
Is yours an earlier model ? Mine is serial number 26.
Stan

Anonymous 23 Aug 2007

#11

Joe fox has the prototype hc3p cuff. Stan has what is called first production run. boa did a very small laser cut run of hand cuffs. some still call it prototype. I do not. boa mite call it proto. Any cuff with a serial number is first production. The ones with out were made by hand. The production cuffs were still put together by hand .The action on both cuffs are the same. The prototypes do not have a tapered cylinder or red marks on it to tell you were double lock is. The prototype also does not have the extended pawl for shimming like similar to the xj cuff. The prototype also did not have the lip at the top of the pawl. I hope I used all the correct terms that you guys use.

Anonymous 23 Aug 2007

#12

The proto also is the same cuff the production cuff has a left and a right cuff

Anonymous 23 Aug 2007

#13

the 3rd location could have been with the key turned tip up pitting the tip right unthe the catch. this could only have been done on first run of cuffmaxx.

Anonymous 23 Aug 2007

#14

i do think you get the idea

bill 23 Aug 2007

#15

$1200 and a pair of clejuso model 102 current offer. I would really like a pair of 101 instead. I do not think I am high. someone could be the only one to have proto and first production run.

Stan Willis 23 Aug 2007

#16

Does anyone know haw many production cuffs (the ones with the serial numbers and marked model HC3P were made ?
Stan

Anonymous 23 Aug 2007

#17

i think it was 30 or 35 proto was about 10

Anonymous 23 Aug 2007

#18

does anyone know the last difference with them?

Unimuc 23 Aug 2007

#19

Hi,

@Anonymous: I think that's exactly how the 3rd position works, the key inside is turned up and so locks the cuff - this even works on normal peerless cuffs (not on s&w or hiatts) so I think BOA could have done this also with the cuffmaxx retrofit kit. Why they didn't - I have no idea. But it was a mistake.

@Joe: can you tell if your prototype works the same as Stan's cuff? But from the description (double lock via medeco cylinder) I expect it does... Of course except for that it isn't mirrored...

The missing anti-shim jar in my opinion is no problem for the "real" BOA cuffs, as they are securely locked using the cylinder. Shimming only is a real issue with the newer peerless cuffmaxx cuffs - and there I expect the jar not to be of much help when attacked with the right tools...

Martin (who really would like to add a real BOA cuff to his collection(*), but actually I'd prefer the BOA production over the prototype. And I guess $1200 also is a bit over my personal limit - but anyway, Bill, I'd really love to see a picture of your actual cuff. We discussed it so much now, just go grab your neighbors digital camera and send us some pictures )

(*) I already have Medeco Peerless leg irons, ASSA Peerless handcuffs and belly chain, and ASSA S&W Handcuffs and leg irons, giving a nice overview of the various cuffmaxx sets

Anonymous 23 Aug 2007

#20

it was not a mistake it could not properly be done on cuffmaxx. and 3 pin prototype and production run cuffs work the same way. but the cylinder is in different directions and the cuffs on the proto are the same cuff.

Joseph Fox 23 Aug 2007

#21

http://www.blacksteel.com/hcs/index.cgi ... &collector

Here's the info. that I have on my pair - based on the sales flyers & correspondence from Alan (BOA Co.): ____________________________________________

Original HC3P Hand-Made Prototype Handcuffs:

*Cut on conventional milling machine & lathed.
*BOA name chemically etched on each cuff.
*3-pin Medeco Straight sleeve cylinder.
*No extension of a single strand for anti-shimming.
*304 stainless steel.
*Only one other cuff was made like it (sold to Tom Gross).

Mark Lyons 23 Aug 2007

#22

Hi,

My pair is number 23 and seems to be identical to the pair in Stan's collection.
Alan, who developed these cuffs at Boa HC/Kenstan Lock told me that these were made to present to the patent office. I believe there were 25 of these made.
I recall some of the first Boa cuffs that sold on eBay were in the $250 range. Most of the later models (like mine ands Stan's) went for about $500
Alan said that the early models that were first sold may not have worked as smooth as the patent models if at all. When questioned why he started the auction price at $500, he replied that it cost him and his company about $2,000 to make each pair and that $500 was still not near enough to recoup his money.

The cuff body at the hinge end on the early models had the conventional rounded end.
The Patent models had spear point or triangular tips. That design was supposed to be a "guide" that helped the cuff center around the wrist when applied quickly.

mark
O--O

lockknight75 24 Aug 2007

#23

The first pairs works some what smooth. It took alot of work to get your cuffs to be as good as they are. i will put it out there like this it was a pain to get that little roll pin in that holds the catch.

cufmanNJ 24 Aug 2007

#24

if the pair of cuffs dont have a serial # then how do we know they are genuine BOA (worth 1000+$)and not a basement copy made on your fathers old millin machene

Joseph Fox 24 Aug 2007

#25

I'll bring mine to the Cannon's Escape Convention - for comparisons.
Stan, and others too?

Anonymous 24 Aug 2007

#26

I know what eveyone has by the pictures if your not sure post the picture.

lockknight75 25 Aug 2007

#27

cufmanj, who do you think has a fake.

Unimuc 25 Aug 2007

#28

Hi,

@Anonymous: why couldn't it be properly done on the cuffmaxx? As far as I see it, the peerless cuffs would be lockable using the right key position, all it should need is a second position for the sidebar in the lock? This way the cuff really would be locked using the cylinder like in the original design.

@cufmanNJ: creating a copy of a laser cut handcuff isn't something you do in your garage. Of course it would be possible to replicate these cuffs, but I doubt the copies would be cheaper in the making than the original. And if so, what would a serial number change?! Is it impossible to add serial numbers on fakes? The only thing you can be sure when you have a serial on your cuff is, that it's not a genuine BOA prototype, as those obviously don't have numbers... So, I don't believe there are BOA fakes around, with or without number.

Martin

bill 25 Aug 2007

#29

martin do you have a pair of boa cuffs? I thought I was the only person up at 3 am

Anonymous 25 Aug 2007

#30

The location would cut thru the shell that it is in. long story