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Genuine ball and cuff???

10 visible archived posts ยท 10 preserved total ยท topic ID 5240
Original topic โ†—Recovered images
newbiee44 18 Mar 2013
#1
Hi guys just trying to find out some back ground or history of this ball and chain, I can say by studying it closely that it weighs 25 kg (55 lbs) it is a lead ball covered in an outer brass casing the chain is a close link inter woven type so it is hard to get anything between the links to twist them off the cuff has a large bolt through the hinge and is welded heavily on both ends, also where the lock goes it is also heavily welded to make it harder to cut into. The cuff has an old felt lining which would have been added on at a later date but is still very old and worn. This was definatly heavily used you can see the wear marks of where it would have been pucked up and put down thousdands of times, the paint was orange at one stage and this has worn down as well. I am guessing that it was used in a prison at a later stage and painted orange and had a felt cuff added for humanitarian reasons. This looks very real to me and does not look like a fake, if it is a fake they went to alot of trouble to make it a usable ball and chain. Regards Jim.













Mark Lyons 18 Mar 2013
#2
Yes, someone did go to a lot of trouble to make these...but it was not manufactured at a factory and intended for penitentiary use.
The modern electric welding and the fact that the ball is covered in brass veneer and weighs in at 55 pounds are also indications that this was made in someone's garage. These are about twice as heavy as those made by Tower or Bean. Ball and chains were made so the prisoner could be mobile enough to get his work done, just cumbersome enough that a rapid flight isn't possible.

Could it be that this home made restraint was made by an amateur and bought over to a prison for use? Yes, it is possible, but very, very unlikely and without a photo or letter from the warden, you will have to give up thinking about which famous villain had the pleasure of wearing these particular restraints on a hot, humid day down in the deep south.



mark

O--O
newbiee44 18 Mar 2013
#3
Hi guys just trying to find out some back ground or history of this ball and chain, I can say by studying it closely that it weighs 25 kg (55 lbs) it is a lead ball covered in an outer brass casing the chain is a close link inter woven type so it is hard to get anything between the links to twist them off the cuff has a large bolt through the hinge and is welded heavily on both ends, also where the lock goes it is also heavily welded to make it harder to cut into. The cuff has an old felt lining which would have been added on at a later date but is still very old and worn. This was definatly heavily used you can see the wear marks of where it would have been pucked up and put down thousdands of times, the paint was orange at one stage and this has worn down as well. I am guessing that it was used in a prison at a later stage and painted orange and had a felt cuff added for humanitarian reasons. This looks very real to me and does not look like a fake, if it is a fake they went to alot of trouble to make it a usable ball and chain. Regards Jim.













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Thanks for the reply Mark I understand what you are saying I also got answers from Ian who is saying pretty much what you are saying, someone made this in their home garage, I am not desperate to make this real but that said can you explain the extensive wear marks around the areas where if it were used it would have worn, can that be reproduced??? Also someone making this as a fake went to a real lot of trouble to use high grade steel and make it very tamper proof for something that was never meant to be used for real. I understand you guys are more expert at this then me and laugh at guys like me trying to make things real but remeber you have not seen everything yet. Do you base the garage comment on what you have seen in ball and chains so far or know for a fact these were produced by a person in his garage because you have seen this type of ball and chain before, not trying to offend just trying to figure out the level of expertese I am dealing with. Regards Jim.
mark lyons 18 Mar 2013
#4
Hi guys just trying to find out some back ground or history of this ball and chain, I can say by studying it closely that it weighs 25 kg (55 lbs) it is a lead ball covered in an outer brass casing the chain is a close link inter woven type so it is hard to get anything between the links to twist them off the cuff has a large bolt through the hinge and is welded heavily on both ends, also where the lock goes it is also heavily welded to make it harder to cut into. The cuff has an old felt lining which would have been added on at a later date but is still very old and worn. This was definatly heavily used you can see the wear marks of where it would have been pucked up and put down thousdands of times, the paint was orange at one stage and this has worn down as well. I am guessing that it was used in a prison at a later stage and painted orange and had a felt cuff added for humanitarian reasons. This looks very real to me and does not look like a fake, if it is a fake they went to alot of trouble to make it a usable ball and chain. Regards Jim.













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Well, many of us on this forum have well over 20 years experience in collecting. We communicate and research all types of restraints. Some of our members are very good at metallurgy and some can tell what years a certain kind of electric weld occurred.

Learning what I can from my own reading and from what others have shared, ball and chains were made by a few manufactures and are listed in their catalogs. They offered balls in 15, 20, 25 pound options and may even offer other weights on custom orders. Normally, they come with 6 foot chains and have a swivel in the middle somewhere. Longer or shorter chains could be custom ordered as well. The leg iron at the end is their usual hardware and no felt lining was provided. There were others made elsewhere that did not have built in locks. They were secured by padlocks or rivets.


Your item possesses characteristics that simply fall far from mainstream manufacturing. That large bolt being used as a hinge pin also screams of garage manufacturing.


As I understand it, these items were used from around the turn of the century up until the late 30's.
Perhaps one of the welding experts can elaborate here, but I believe electric welding was a benefit of technology perfected during WWll. I do know that the type of modern welding as we know it became available in the late 50's. Your restraint indicates that it was made after the late 1950's when ball and chains were pretty much outlawed.


Ball and chains are mostly associated with this country. Is it possible that yours is from Russia, or South America? It is possible. I have never heard of these countries using such devices and I can't explain the wear and tear your item displays, but from a value point of view, unless some other information comes to light, yours was a garage made item and must be valued as such.


These things show up on eBay quite regularly and their seller often tells tales of being found in a barn on a plantation, or someone's uncle was the sheriff of TumbleWeed Junction.

No, nobody here will laugh at you. I laugh at the sellers above as they try to reel one in with their stupid stories with the intent to rip someone off.
You asked a legitimate questions and you deserve a legitimate answer. I hope others will input their opinions in this matter as well.


Mark
O---------O
Jim 21 Mar 2013
#5
Hi guys just trying to find out some back ground or history of this ball and chain, I can say by studying it closely that it weighs 25 kg (55 lbs) it is a lead ball covered in an outer brass casing the chain is a close link inter woven type so it is hard to get anything between the links to twist them off the cuff has a large bolt through the hinge and is welded heavily on both ends, also where the lock goes it is also heavily welded to make it harder to cut into. The cuff has an old felt lining which would have been added on at a later date but is still very old and worn. This was definatly heavily used you can see the wear marks of where it would have been pucked up and put down thousdands of times, the paint was orange at one stage and this has worn down as well. I am guessing that it was used in a prison at a later stage and painted orange and had a felt cuff added for humanitarian reasons. This looks very real to me and does not look like a fake, if it is a fake they went to alot of trouble to make it a usable ball and chain. Regards Jim.













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I appreciate you took the time to answer me so thoroughly Mark, I hear what you say and I understand totally, yes the bolt does look unusual but they heavy tamper proof welding around it does not make sense, why bother with so much if made in a back yard for ornamental purposes. I didn't photograph every angle but it is extensive. I can only go by what I see studying the ball and chain in person. The felt appears to have been a later addition as well as the brass surround on the ball, when I look under the brass (it is coming away) there are wear marks and dints and scrapes which don't match the copper outside cover, this leads me to the conclusion those marks had to have been made without the brass cover being there. Also where the felt has come away again there is wear and pitting underneath the felt; did they ever make balls and chains just to make people suffer in their cells??? The extensive wear marks all over this thing is the most unusual thing about it, if it were fake people like you and I would have worn it for a few minutes for a laugh, this wear is long and deep made over decades. It's a shame not many people are answering this message, every bit helps and is appreciated.
Jim 21 Mar 2013
#6
Hi guys just trying to find out some back ground or history of this ball and chain, I can say by studying it closely that it weighs 25 kg (55 lbs) it is a lead ball covered in an outer brass casing the chain is a close link inter woven type so it is hard to get anything between the links to twist them off the cuff has a large bolt through the hinge and is welded heavily on both ends, also where the lock goes it is also heavily welded to make it harder to cut into. The cuff has an old felt lining which would have been added on at a later date but is still very old and worn. This was definatly heavily used you can see the wear marks of where it would have been pucked up and put down thousdands of times, the paint was orange at one stage and this has worn down as well. I am guessing that it was used in a prison at a later stage and painted orange and had a felt cuff added for humanitarian reasons. This looks very real to me and does not look like a fake, if it is a fake they went to alot of trouble to make it a usable ball and chain. Regards Jim.













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Also just wanted to say, I could have removed the felt, the copper cover and the rest of the paint that is left to make this look more primitive, I hope you can all see I am just trying to get answers on this in the exact condition I bought it for. I accept it could have been made in a garage but I can't see how they would have fashioned their cuff so well with the thickness of the metal and also why use tamper proof chain??? I came across it by luck as I went to a guy's house to pickup something else and found this in a corner of the garage, his garage was full of crap from top to bottom, we were both searching for a small part for what I bought and this was in an old wooden box covered by stuff. He genuinely looked surprised to see it again and he said he had it for around 25 years, he was an older gentleman and he said his grandfather had it when he passed away. Yes he did go into a real big story about this. I did not want to repeat it because like you I believe people tell you anything to make an item more worthwhile. I didn't pay an arm and a leg for it, even though that was what he was asking for. His wife came into the garage to see why we were taking so long and she cracked it when she saw the ball and chain. She wanted it gone and thought it was years ago. He had hidden it in the box and I offered a ridiculous amount of money and he (sorry she) took it. She thought it was bad karma / luck to have it around. I on the other hand see it as good karma because while I have it no-one will ever suffer in it again.
Ian McColl 21 Mar 2013
#7
Hi guys just trying to find out some back ground or history of this ball and chain, I can say by studying it closely that it weighs 25 kg (55 lbs) it is a lead ball covered in an outer brass casing the chain is a close link inter woven type so it is hard to get anything between the links to twist them off the cuff has a large bolt through the hinge and is welded heavily on both ends, also where the lock goes it is also heavily welded to make it harder to cut into. The cuff has an old felt lining which would have been added on at a later date but is still very old and worn. This was definatly heavily used you can see the wear marks of where it would have been pucked up and put down thousdands of times, the paint was orange at one stage and this has worn down as well. I am guessing that it was used in a prison at a later stage and painted orange and had a felt cuff added for humanitarian reasons. This looks very real to me and does not look like a fake, if it is a fake they went to alot of trouble to make it a usable ball and chain. Regards Jim.













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Jim, the reason for the cuff has a nice curve, is because it is a piece of heavy gauge pipe cut in half. It is not tamper resistant chain, there is no such thing. The flange for locking it, is a piece welded to it. The hex bolt is modern. In the days of this type of unit, it would be a square head bolt. None of it makes sense which is why you aren't getting the responses you want.
You suggest the maker has gone to so much trouble. It takes seconds to apply arc welds. It takes more time and trouble to grind welds back and make it look good, clean and quality. Left like this, it appears birds has crapped on it instead.

I am very, very sure the old man had a great story to go with it. He probably regaled the story to the grandkids every weekend and to anyone who listened.

Which reminds me of a story.

A village nutter sat on a wall by the side of a road. He was casting a pretend fishing pole back and forth and if he imagined he had a bite, he would pretend to reel it in.
A man walking down the road was watching this for a while and when he went past the fisherman, he asked "Caught any??"
The nutter looked up and replied "You're the first!"
Coldsteelcuffs 21 Mar 2013
#8
Hi guys just trying to find out some back ground or history of this ball and chain, I can say by studying it closely that it weighs 25 kg (55 lbs) it is a lead ball covered in an outer brass casing the chain is a close link inter woven type so it is hard to get anything between the links to twist them off the cuff has a large bolt through the hinge and is welded heavily on both ends, also where the lock goes it is also heavily welded to make it harder to cut into. The cuff has an old felt lining which would have been added on at a later date but is still very old and worn. This was definatly heavily used you can see the wear marks of where it would have been pucked up and put down thousdands of times, the paint was orange at one stage and this has worn down as well. I am guessing that it was used in a prison at a later stage and painted orange and had a felt cuff added for humanitarian reasons. This looks very real to me and does not look like a fake, if it is a fake they went to alot of trouble to make it a usable ball and chain. Regards Jim.













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Just to elaborate about the wear marks..

Consider that the items that are pieced together to make this "fantasy" piece were used in other applications that created these "wear" marks.

Outside of the idea that these types of restraints were actually used by a prisoner. Think outside of the pure "real" convict restraint.

It's more than probable that some cobbler in his garage was into role-play or BDSM and both were into Kink..
Anonymous 21 Mar 2013
#9
Hi guys just trying to find out some back ground or history of this ball and chain, I can say by studying it closely that it weighs 25 kg (55 lbs) it is a lead ball covered in an outer brass casing the chain is a close link inter woven type so it is hard to get anything between the links to twist them off the cuff has a large bolt through the hinge and is welded heavily on both ends, also where the lock goes it is also heavily welded to make it harder to cut into. The cuff has an old felt lining which would have been added on at a later date but is still very old and worn. This was definatly heavily used you can see the wear marks of where it would have been pucked up and put down thousdands of times, the paint was orange at one stage and this has worn down as well. I am guessing that it was used in a prison at a later stage and painted orange and had a felt cuff added for humanitarian reasons. This looks very real to me and does not look like a fake, if it is a fake they went to alot of trouble to make it a usable ball and chain. Regards Jim.













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This is a big ball of junk
Jim 21 Mar 2013
#10
Hi guys just trying to find out some back ground or history of this ball and chain, I can say by studying it closely that it weighs 25 kg (55 lbs) it is a lead ball covered in an outer brass casing the chain is a close link inter woven type so it is hard to get anything between the links to twist them off the cuff has a large bolt through the hinge and is welded heavily on both ends, also where the lock goes it is also heavily welded to make it harder to cut into. The cuff has an old felt lining which would have been added on at a later date but is still very old and worn. This was definatly heavily used you can see the wear marks of where it would have been pucked up and put down thousdands of times, the paint was orange at one stage and this has worn down as well. I am guessing that it was used in a prison at a later stage and painted orange and had a felt cuff added for humanitarian reasons. This looks very real to me and does not look like a fake, if it is a fake they went to alot of trouble to make it a usable ball and chain. Regards Jim.













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You are totally right guys I looked up the original ball and chains you guys were talking about and they were completely different. There is not one item that is even close to this. I see what you mean about the longer chains and different ankle cuffs. At least I didn't get fleeced and bought it for peanuts so I would always get my money back (maybe even make a couple of dollars) when and if I choose to sell it. Remember the golden rule with all of this "stuff" we are dealing in, the longer it sits the older it gets and the more it appreciates. Still a great conversation piece and nice to display. I am really glad I joined this site you guys really know your stuff. Just have to find the right lock and keys for it now, thanks heaps to everyone who contributed to this message.