Question about a Griffin Plug 8

I just picked up my first Griffin Plug 8 Handcuff. 

I couldn't see the markings in the listing and the written description had me confused as to if it would be marked Hiatt Griffin or just Griffin. Either way, I thought that the price was worth it, so I took a gamble and bought it. 



When it was delivered yesterday, I saw that it was marked "Griffin". Unfortunately, it didn't come with a plug. 



Does anyone know what the date range is that it would have been made? 

Any information would be appreciated.

I did see that one on eBay but did not want to risk eBay confiscating it. 
To summarise what has been covered, Thomas Griffin died in 1816. His nephew Thomas Griffin Hiatt, born 1785, said Hiatt started business in 1780. So the start date must have been for his uncle Thomas Griffin. Nichols and Hill took over the Griffin business in 1816, but at some stage there were cuffs marked Griffin and Hiatt. There might have been a partnership before Griffin died because Hiatt was in business by himself by at least 1818 when Nichols was still in business as well. 
I think every English collection should have one of these. They are one of the earliest Branded handcuffs as opposed to unbranded ones from earlier.

Thank you, Paul. Luckily they shipped via FedEx instead of eBay's Global Shipping Program.
So the date range would be put somewhere between 1780 & 1816. Would 1816 be when they started using "Griffin & co" markings, or would "Griffin & co" cover part of the same date range as the plain "Griffin" marked cuffs?

Just plain Griffin is by far the most common mark. My guess is that any other mark would be near the end of the time period discussed by Paul. 

Nice item. Congratulations.
Joe

Thank you, Joe. I expected it to come with a Griffin Hiatt stamping because the auction title mentioned both manufacturers besides calling them Irish 8's.

This was the only Plug handcuff in my collection that was missing it's plug, so I ordered a replacement plug from Ian.


It fits perfectly. Missing keys and plugs always drive me nuts.


It bothered me so much that I didn't even notice this huge "V" marking on the side of the lock tube until I put in the new plug to take these pictures.



I can't imagine how I could have missed it. I've never seen markings on a plug lock tube before, so my best guess is that I just didn't look there. Either that or it's time to get new eyeglasses.
Getting older really does suck.

That is interesting. I suspect the V is filed on after manufacture and could be a roman numeral and is not a broad arrow. There is no number on the key either. I have a few cuffs which have dots stamped on them to indicate numbers.  I have a few riveted leg irons which have chisel strike marks to indicate numbers ( some say it is to indicate how many time the irons have been worn, but I'm yet to be convinced) but I have not seen a mark like yours on cuffs except Lilly irons. 
Ian used to make lost wax cast plugs but I think they are made by hand now? Missing keys and plugs drive me nuts too.
Paul

Not enough interest or patronage  from collectors to get items cast .  Last time I invested money into making new Judd/Mattatuck keys on  the word of another collector I got stitched up. Claimed there were several people who needed/required multiples numbers of keys. He said the quantity would sufficient to warrant an order and time to make them and not one of the people he claimed told him, ever contacted me.  

I'm happy to have added another Griffin. Marked Griffin & co.


This one didn't come with a plug either, but thanks to Ian, it now has a replacement.


I had to try a few keys before I found one that fit. The lock tube is narrower than my other plug cuffs.

Very nice cuff. I had been watching that one for what seems like a year. The price was not unreasonable for a very early plug 8 with makers mark and very good condition. Congratulations. I also like to make them complete with a plug and a key.

Thanks, Paul.
I agree. The price was too high. I made the seller an offer.

I said the price was NOT unreasonable. So you did OK. I would have bought them if there were no postal issues. Looking forward to seeing your next old English acquisition. Paul

Sorry, Paul, I misread your post. I had been watching that cuff for a long time also, but I was hoping that the price would come down just a bit. I was extremely happy when he accepted my offer.

I did pick up one other Plug cuff. This one is an unmarked neck collar. This one did come with the original plug though.



Here it is opened.

Neck collars of any manufacture are quite rare, nice find.

Spencer

That's a very nice collar too! Maybe one day when you get tired of it we can do a deal. I have a lot of good American cuffs that no longer interest me. Paul

Thank you Paul, I'll keep that in mind. There are many American cuffs that are still on my list that are missing from my collection.

Paul

Would you mind contacting me about any American cuffs that you would consider parting with?

Spencer

I did send these photos to 2 other collectors on here but did not hear back, so to be fair, here they are for all to see. I don't need money, I need rare old English cuffs and the like. Also, I am in Australia which might put some people off.

Try again - a few more.

Thanks Paul those are excellent photos and you have some nice pieces there but unfortunately I don’t have any items you are looking for to trade with.

Spencer

Are either Palmers a Number 2?

Palmers with chain are number 2