chicago handcuffs and is this forum is dying

activity here looks like its in a decline as time goes on.. maybe its just the fate of forums in general who knows.. just an observation.

next i grabbed two pairs of Chicago colored chain handcuffs a few months ago and yeah they are pretty much playtime cuffs and not for professional use imo.. personal use they seem fine but perhaps only a step above toy level restraints..

they of course use a standard key and it doesnt seem like you can just pull them apart with human strength but the keyholes are seriously the size of texas. you could probably stick a coat hanger in each keyhole given the opportunity.

i haven't seen any torque strength tests on any chicago cuff models but id be interested to know at which force level they fail.

when you compare the density of the chicago metal to peerless chain there's nothing in common. peerless wins hands down. heavier thicker and just clearly a higher quality metal product.

sure the Chicago brand is cheaper but if you need quality for leo or security then my advice is stick with peerless or asp sentry. i think chicago is probably just a good stocking stuffer option for bedroom use.

Chicago is a house brand for Handcuffwarehouse.com. Most of their models are made in Taiwan. Not the highest quality, but also not the worst. In my opinion, I would not carry them for professional work. For just a few dollars more, you can pick up a standard set of Peerless or S&W and be better off. Unfortunately, until the justice system in America allows for a higher security handcuff to become standard use and abandon the all too common current standard key, any handcuff used in the American policing institutions is going to be vulnerable.
-Richard Knip-

I think this forum has always been about quality over quantity. All the experts and serious collectors are here and the posts tend to be more focussed. Don’t really see it dying.


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Chicago modern swing-through handcuffs are VERY nice quality, for a Taiwan handcuff. Chicago X55 are tested to NIJ specifications, the same as Peerless or Smith & Wesson. I see no reason why their non-NIJ handcuffs aren't as good. It costs a lot of money and time to get NIJ ratings. The same manufacturer who makes Chicago also makes Winchester handcuffs and those are also NIJ rated.

The nice thing with Chicago cuffs is the double lock bar inside the mechanism is split, so sometimes an escape attempt will fail because you think you picked the double lock, you know you did because you can even see the activator popped back out to non-double lock status but it's still double locked. And the Chicago X22 are just really nice. I want to get another pair some day.

As for breakage, Smith & Wesson and Peerless, as well as ASP and HIATT can all be chain-bound and snapped by someone wearing them. No tools needed, just crunch... hands free. And they can all be picked. ASP is one of the easiest handcuffs to pick and absolutely one of the easiest to shim. Handcuffs are temporary restraints. All the big brands are good and adequate. In my opinion, Chicago are too.

Also, with ASP sentry, you can shim them with paper... So if you smack them against a wall or desk (the Whack Attack) to disengage the double lock, you could shim out of them using paper. Even despite this, I still love ASP Sentry. I love the fact Sentry (and even the modern Ultra Plus) has metal contact points for the key interaction instead of plastic, for added longevity.

GUEST wrote: ↑

Dec 17, 2024

activity here looks like its in a decline as time goes on.. maybe its just the fate of forums in general who knows.. just an observation.

Anonymous guests bring down the tone of the forum

GUEST wrote: ↑

Dec 17, 2024

when you compare the density of the chicago metal to peerless chain there's nothing in common. peerless wins hands down. heavier thicker and just clearly a higher quality metal product.

BTW the steel density does not correlate with strength. Strength primarily depends on alloying additives

Hammering can make steel stronger by deforming its crystal structure, which increases its hardness and tensile strength. This process is called "work-hardening".  , 

There is an indescribable difference in quality between Chicago and Peerless that I cannot describe. As far as the physical aspect, I feel like Peerless is better. But over all, actually... they are the same. I would trust Chicago as much as I trust Peerless. Both are NIJ rated, like Winchester. I cannot describe it but my perception is Peerless is far better. But I know deep down after having tested them and seen official ratings that Chicago actually are as good and in the double lock department better than Peerless since it's a split bar for the double lock.

There is NOTHING wrong with Chicago modern handcuffs. Disregard reproductions of old stuff, I am talking about modern handcuffs of Chicago.

Most handcuffs can be cut off, picked, shimmed if single locked, chain bound and snapped etc. But Chicago are as good and trustworthy as the big names IMO.

silentbd wrote: ↑

Dec 21, 2024

Most handcuffs can be cut off, picked, shimmed if single locked, chain bound and snapped etc. But Chicago are as good and trustworthy as the big names IMO.

Absolutely all handcuffs can be cut off with bolt cutters or a dremel with a diamond cutting disc.

Anonims wrote: ↑

Dec 22, 2024

Absolutely all handcuffs can be cut off with bolt cutters or a dremel with a diamond cutting disc.

really Mark?

silentbd wrote: ↑

Dec 21, 2024

There is an indescribable difference in quality between Chicago and Peerless that I cannot describe.

but you just did.

Poor PATHETIC Ian McColl thinks that I responded to his infantile bantering.
In this exception, I will comment and state that I didn't reply to the above messages even though he emulated my "O--O" logo/symbol to make it appear that I did!
There isn't enough time or interest in this topic for me to comment about Chicago handcuffs and their weaknesses.

If we were talking about vintage or historic cuffs, I would have a greater inclination to respond.

I must say that when you were absent from this website, it was much nicer, friendlier and without controversy.
Believe me when I say that your garbage isn't welcome here and I know for a fact that your behavior caused a few people to leave this site and are simply tired of your crap.  The author stated that this Forum is dying and we know that you, McColl is the primary reason that this is happening.
In the day, you contributed your knowledge and help with providing keys.  It was a welcome addition and support for our hobby.
Those days are long behind you and not many want to deal with you anymore.
Mental health issues or lack of medication may be what made you change and that is a shame.
I am not qualified to say what is wrong with you but in private messages between many here, you are impossible to deal with and it is very sad.
Not many wish to order keys from you, and I gave up trying.  I had to contact PayPal to get my money ($510) back because you made such a nasty experience out of it, and I know others that refuse to deal with you.
I will say that you were pretty talented and fun, but you have become too difficult to deal with.
PLEASE go away while many of us wish your absence becomes permanent....and Merry CHRISTMAS!!

This is a nice place to come to talk about handcuffs, outside of facebook. This is more accessible than facebook. I am not normally a FB kind of guy. I only got FB for cuffs groups. There's no need for trolling and imo the anonymous guest thing should not even be possible. I have found such amazing info here. I just hope people don't drag this down because it seems there's basically no moderation here. which is a bit sad.

I wonder if the members and Joe Lauher should have an open discussion on moderating and the future of this forum board? I very much dislike seeing people being pushed away from sharing on here. These pages are a treasure trove of knowledge collecting through many, many years. Of course, moderating a forum page is not an easy task. Something cant be taken down just because you or I dont like what is being said. I would think the main goal of a moderator on this type of page is to keep members on topic and limit openly sexual type material among other things. Never having worked with this platform, i dont know how barring people and the anonymous posting thing would work? I would hope that there would be a way to be able to control both as a board moderator, but i just dont know. Not sure if there is a way to cut out the anonymous posting aspect this platform offers? Personally, i feel that a forum of this type should only allow members to post on its pages or at least somehow I.D. the person who is posting. Keeping trolls at bay. Easier said than done, I am sure.
-Richard Knip-

Mark Lyons O--O Cuffs wrote:Poor PATHETIC Ian McColl thinks that I responded to his infantile bantering.
In this exception, I will comment and state that I didn't reply to the above messages even though he emulated my "O--O" logo/symbol to make it appear that I did!
There isn't enough time or interest in this topic for me to comment about Chicago handcuffs and their weaknesses.

If we were talking about vintage or historic cuffs, I would have a greater inclination to respond.

I must say that when you were absent from this website, it was much nicer, friendlier and without controversy.
Believe me when I say that your garbage isn't welcome here and I know for a fact that your behavior caused a few people to leave this site and are simply tired of your crap.  The author stated that this Forum is dying and we know that you, McColl is the primary reason that this is happening.
In the day, you contributed your knowledge and help with providing keys.  It was a welcome addition and support for our hobby.
Those days are long behind you and not many want to deal with you anymore.
Mental health issues or lack of medication may be what made you change and that is a shame.
I am not qualified to say what is wrong with you but in private messages between many here, you are impossible to deal with and it is very sad.
Not many wish to order keys from you, and I gave up trying.  I had to contact PayPal to get my money ($510) back because you made such a nasty experience out of it, and I know others that refuse to deal with you.
I will say that you were pretty talented and fun, but you have become too difficult to deal with.
PLEASE go away while many of us wish your absence becomes permanent....and Merry CHRISTMAS!!

Click to expand...

Nominated for best post of 2024!
Agree completely.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

james.slips wrote: ↑

Jan 02, 2025

Mark Lyons O--O Cuffs wrote:Poor PATHETIC Ian McColl thinks that I responded to his infantile bantering.
In this exception, I will comment and state that I didn't reply to the above messages even though he emulated my "O--O" logo/symbol to make it appear that I did!
There isn't enough time or interest in this topic for me to comment about Chicago handcuffs and their weaknesses.

If we were talking about vintage or historic cuffs, I would have a greater inclination to respond.

I must say that when you were absent from this website, it was much nicer, friendlier and without controversy.
Believe me when I say that your garbage isn't welcome here and I know for a fact that your behavior caused a few people to leave this site and are simply tired of your crap.  The author stated that this Forum is dying and we know that you, McColl is the primary reason that this is happening.
In the day, you contributed your knowledge and help with providing keys.  It was a welcome addition and support for our hobby.
Those days are long behind you and not many want to deal with you anymore.
Mental health issues or lack of medication may be what made you change and that is a shame.
I am not qualified to say what is wrong with you but in private messages between many here, you are impossible to deal with and it is very sad.
Not many wish to order keys from you, and I gave up trying.  I had to contact PayPal to get my money ($510) back because you made such a nasty experience out of it, and I know others that refuse to deal with you.
I will say that you were pretty talented and fun, but you have become too difficult to deal with.
PLEASE go away while many of us wish your absence becomes permanent....and Merry CHRISTMAS!!

Nominated for best post of 2024!
Agree completely.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Click to expand...

James,
Thank you for having the guts to say something about this.
As I stated, many members have written to me privately about the McColl problem and I respect this forum and try very hard to research any info that I can about vintage and collectible cuffs.  I have written many in depth articles and even contributed to all the annuals we had a few years ago.
Aside from some humor and some decent April Fools gags, I also believe that this site is hands down superior to anything on Facebook even though that platform does have some great articles and information too.
I can slide past negative comments, errors or corrections to information I post, but when idiotic nonsense (like pretending to me as above) about mundane and picayunish topics, this childlike behavior simply can't be tolerated.   This forum is all about the hobby where we learn about historic and valuable restraints and is without a doubt the most concise reference on our planet.  This has been a source of great friendships and comradery!
Joe L. certainly is aware of the existing problem and has the right to let it run its course or do a course correction here.
McColl's ridiculous comments these days contribute NOTHING to the hobby!  They used to be factual, helpful and appreciated, but the last few years, they have been all about his stance on politics and religion coupled with his hatred of North Americans and NOTHING about handcuffs.  WE DON"T CARE!!!!
I remember so many people that used to be regular contributors here and they haven't posted anything in the last decade.  Some of them wrote to me directly and asked for help identifying items because they were afraid of being ridiculed by McColl.  I know of others that experienced the same and it seems that regular contributors have dwindled down to just a handful of people.  He is not 100% to blame as some have passed on or lost interest, but he is a major fault that these pages have lost some luster.
I hope I don't have to continue writing about this ugliness, but I do want to say that I appreciated being a contributing member here for a long time and had a great time learning, writing and making some great friends!
With all that needs to be said, I wish that all the respectable folks here will have a HAPPY and HEALTHY 2025!

djhalfdead wrote: ↑

Dec 31, 2024

I wonder if the members and Joe Lauher should have an open discussion on moderating and the future of this forum board? I very much dislike seeing people being pushed away from sharing on here. These pages are a treasure trove of knowledge collecting through many, many years. Of course, moderating a forum page is not an easy task. Something cant be taken down just because you or I dont like what is being said. I would think the main goal of a moderator on this type of page is to keep members on topic and limit openly sexual type material among other things. Never having worked with this platform, i dont know how barring people and the anonymous posting thing would work? I would hope that there would be a way to be able to control both as a board moderator, but i just dont know. Not sure if there is a way to cut out the anonymous posting aspect this platform offers? Personally, i feel that a forum of this type should only allow members to post on its pages or at least somehow I.D. the person who is posting. Keeping trolls at bay. Easier said than done, I am sure.
-Richard Knip-

Click to expand...

A couple years ago, we had a closed part here on the forum where only certain members could contribute. It might be a good idea to do something like that again.

CuffmanBelgium wrote: ↑

Jan 02, 2025

djhalfdead wrote: ↑

Dec 31, 2024

I wonder if the members and Joe Lauher should have an open discussion on moderating and the future of this forum board? I very much dislike seeing people being pushed away from sharing on here. These pages are a treasure trove of knowledge collecting through many, many years. Of course, moderating a forum page is not an easy task. Something cant be taken down just because you or I dont like what is being said. I would think the main goal of a moderator on this type of page is to keep members on topic and limit openly sexual type material among other things. Never having worked with this platform, i dont know how barring people and the anonymous posting thing would work? I would hope that there would be a way to be able to control both as a board moderator, but i just dont know. Not sure if there is a way to cut out the anonymous posting aspect this platform offers? Personally, i feel that a forum of this type should only allow members to post on its pages or at least somehow I.D. the person who is posting. Keeping trolls at bay. Easier said than done, I am sure.
-Richard Knip-

A couple years ago, we had a closed part here on the forum where only certain members could contribute. It might be a good idea to do something like that again.

Click to expand...

Yes, I remember the days when we had an upper-level discussion group.  
Selected members were invited and could contribute unencumbered and free from dealing with the problem child that we have now.
It is archived still (I can still see it, but don't know if everyone else can)
The "experts" group did not contain anything but normal cuff conversation, but it offered a nice friendly atmosphere where we could share ideas and knowledge without getting trolled, ridiculed, bashed and condescended as opposed to our current situation.
Not too much activity in there during the last 10-15 years and that is a shame!
I think it went away from use when Tapatalk had its major issue and Joe had to do an intense reset or something.
Not only did we lose members, but we also lost a lot of valuable pictures during that issue too.

Here is the big issue I see. All of the rules do zero good, if no one enforces them. Period. To be a moderator on a source like Tapatalk, the moderator has to be an active member who is not afraid of stepping on a few toes from time to time. Without enforcement, rules do zilch.
-Richard Knip-

djhalfdead wrote: ↑

Jan 02, 2025

Here is the big issue I see. All of the rules do zero good, if no one enforces them. Period. To be a moderator on a source like Tapatalk, the moderator has to be an active member who is not afraid of stepping on a few toes from time to time. Without enforcement, rules do zilch.
-Richard Knip-

I have seen a fair few forums in my time. Moderation can be incredibly useful, as long as the wrong people do not end up with moderator powers. I have seen toxic mods make people not want to go to a forum as much as toxic users on non-moderated ones. But if the balance is right, it makes a huge difference with moderation.